区块链、大数据、云计算和人工智能无疑是近日来最火爆的话题主题，特别是区块链，作为全球最新话题之星，不管是各国企业还是日益疯涨的个人用户（现预估200万个人用户），区块链技术都被看作是下一桶金、即将颠覆互联网及传统商业的神器、解决以往商业问题的法宝。

以下两位嘉宾来自于英国，致力于为欧洲品牌商如LVMH路易酩轩集团和 L'Oreal欧莱雅化妆品集团寻求防伪验真技术解决方案，于近日访问中国并与区块链防伪技术应用方案公司DITO于深圳签署双方合作意向备忘录，协力将相关防伪方案推广到欧洲及更多海外区域及多行业运用之中。

此项合作可能是中英区块链防伪合作项目第一例，亦或是品牌防伪漫漫之路的最重要里程碑之一，中国经济新闻联播网记者针对此次英国嘉宾的中国防伪之旅进行了专程采访。

人物介绍：

中国经济新闻联播网资深记者卢冠彤Summer

英国公司Red Octopus创始人Attul Sehgal阿图尔•塞加尔，英国多次获奖企业家兼伦敦UCL大学客座讲师。曾在世界上最有名的国际企业工作，或担任对方咨询师，包括:RBS 苏格兰皇家银行、 德国电信、 Credit Agricole法国农业信贷银行（法国最大银行）, Affinity Water英国水务局等等。其商务资源和从业经验横跨电信、能源、金融银行，以及管理咨询。尤其是在Affinity Water和RBS任职期间担任高级职位, 引领了许多亿万级别的项目。

英国公司Red Octopus联合创始人 Bruno Moraes布鲁诺•莫赖斯，跨国企业家。曾在欧洲和南美洲地域，在能源、电信、矿产、消费者产品、运输与供应链 和 顶尖管理咨询 等方面有丰富工作经验。在 McKinsey & Company麦肯锡工作多年，在超过25个国家有过项目和团队管理的工作经验。创办了ETC Energy Trends， 领导了巴西第一个地下燃油存储项目，担任联合创始人以及相关项目Stogas的董事成员， 募集了超过 7千万美金的资金， 并且是在巴西第一个拿到此类项目许可的案例。

Journalist: Summer

记者：萨默

Good afternoon! Welcome to Shenzhen, and to China. My name is Summer and today I will interview you about your journey in China. Attul, you are going to introduce yourself first.

下午好！欢迎来到中国深圳。我的名字叫萨默，今天我有幸能对您的中国之旅进行采访。阿图尔，您愿意先进行下自我介绍吗？

Guest: Attul Sehgal

嘉宾：阿图尔•塞加尔Attul Sehgal

My name is Attul Sehgal as far as business job is concerned, I am an entrepreneur from the UK, from my background,  I’ve have had some successful innovations launched over the years in gaming, in royalty and fintech.  In the corporate world I have been working in retail banking, in utilities and the water space and really I was just coming here to understand the great innovations that are taking place in China and how myself and my colleague Bruno are going to build a proposition from this to satisfy our client prospects.

我名叫阿图尔•塞加尔，就商业而言，我是一名来自英国的企业家，多年以来，我（先后）在博彩行业、版权行业及金融科技打造了不少成功的创新（产品）。同时，我积累了零售银行、公用设施和供水领域的工作经验；我到这儿来的目的，是真心想了解在中国正在发生的伟大的（市场和技术的）变革创新，我和我的同事布鲁诺希望能够在这儿获得（商业）灵感。

Journalist: Summer

记者：萨默

Bruno, do you want to say hallo to the audience and introduce yourself a little bit? 

布鲁诺，可以和观众打个招呼吗？介绍下您自己吧？

Guest: Bruno Moraes

嘉宾：布鲁诺•莫赖斯

My name is Bruno and I am an entrepreneur as well, I am originally from Brazil where I was working in the energy sector mostly in the infrastructure and developing underground gas storage. I moved recently to the UK to explore the startup space and acquire new venture opportunities in the UK.

我的名字是布鲁诺，我也是一名企业家。我来自于巴西，我曾(在巴西）从事于能源行业，主要涉及公共基建和地下燃气存储开发事务。最近我（搬）来到了英国，开始（在英国）探索“创客”领域和寻找新的创业机遇。

Journalist: Summer

记者：萨默

So, you are international entrepreneurs. 

所以，您是一名跨国企业家。

Guest: Bruno Moraes and Attul Sehgal

嘉宾：布鲁诺•莫赖斯和阿图尔•塞加尔

Yes, we were (successful international entrepreneurs). 

是的，我们都曾是（成功的跨国企业家）

Journalist: Summer

记者：萨默

Very successful with awards?!

获得过奖项（的那种）非常成功？

Guest: Attul Sehgal

嘉宾：阿图尔•塞加尔

Yes, we have won a few.  I think over the years some of the innovations that we have taken to market have received recognition from the sector and we are delighted by that. So, for loyalty, my last innovation I received a number of awards and as an individual I got some best ‘game changer’ accolades and start up CEO awards. So it is always nice to feel that your hard work and diligence is getting some pay-off.

But, I think what drives us even being here is that we both love a good idea. And we know that some great technical innovations is coming up in China and we have to learn more about to see how we can make them into it into great propositions.

是的，我们曾获得很多（奖项）。我们很开心的是，多年以来，我们推出的创新项目获得了市场和行业的认可。比如，最近一次的获奖，是关于我在彩票积分行业的创新项目，该项目获得不少奖项。就个人（获奖）而言，我也获得“Game Changer”奖杯和“创客CEO”奖项。当你的辛勤付出获得了回报是一件很让人感觉很美妙的事情。

But, I think what drives us even being here is that we both love a good idea. And we know that some great innovation is coming up in China and we have to learn more about and to see how we can make it into prosperities.

但是，我觉得我们来到这儿的真正原因是大家都喜欢好创意。并且，我们都觉得，近期中国市场有很多伟大创新，我们必须学习（跟上新事物的节奏）和琢磨如何把它们变现（运用到已有资源中）。

Journalist: Summer

记者：萨默

And I have noticed that you and Bruno have been helping startups to improve their business; Bruno, would you mind introducing a bit more about this.

我已经注意到您和布鲁诺一直在帮助初创企业优化业务；布鲁诺，能否介绍一下关于这方面的内容吗？

Guest: Bruno Moraes

嘉宾：布鲁诺•莫赖斯

Yes. So I joined Wayra as a coach. Wayra is an accelerator run by Telefonica (‘a Spanish telecom group’) in many countries where they operate, I joined in the UK branch and I’m helping in coaching startups that are part of a program that focus on reducing the poverty premium and improve its social impact, and try to reduce the situation where poor people pay more for products and services. It’s very interesting and rewarding to helping businesses startups.

当然可以。我加入了Telephonica（“一家西班牙电信集团”）在多个国家开展的项目“Wayra”导师团队。Wayra 项目是（创客孵化）加速器。（之后）我转到英国分公司，在那儿，我帮助多家海外公司进行创业指导，致力于减少贫富差距和改善相关社会影响；并且，尝试让穷人能够花更少的钱来购买我们的产品和服务。帮助初创企业是非常有趣的，并且很值得。

Journalist: Summer

记者：萨默

And it’s a kind of charity that both of you did?

你们做的属于慈善活动吗？

Guest: Bruno Moraes

嘉宾：布鲁诺•莫赖斯

Oh, this is not about charity to help startups. but it’s an interesting model as there are ways to create social impact and to create a successful business sitiuations.

哦，这（帮助初创企业）并不是慈善事业。这是一个非常有趣的模式，因为可以有办法创造积极的社会影响力和营造一个成功的商业环境。

Journalist: Summer

记者：萨默

What’s your primary purpose for this trip to China this time? 

你这次来中国的主要目的是什么？

Guest: Attul Sehgal

嘉宾：阿图尔•塞加尔

I think I described that we’re coming here to China with a suite of problems that large organizations face and western society faces and really see what great innovation there is in Shenzhen that can help resolve the problems. We have met DITO, a leading innovator in Shenzhen and we just signed a memorandum of understanding to really see how we can help fix the counterfeiting problem.

我觉得可以这样说，我们是带着一些疑问来到中国的，这些问题正是西方大公司和社会所正面临，而（我们在）深圳所了解到的伟大创新（技术和方案）就是（这些问题）的解决方案。我们已经在深圳与一家具有创新技术方案的领军企业DITO签署了《合作意向备忘录》，希望能够（通过协力合作）解决假货问题。

Journalist: Summer

记者：萨默

Alright, so Bruno is your partner to this trip as well.

那么，布鲁诺（作为）您中国之行的搭档，（能否说说你们之间的合作）？

Guest: Attul Sehgal

嘉宾：阿图尔•塞加尔

That’s right and so what is great for us is that my experienced in different sectors is completely different with Bruno’s sector, so complementing both together, which is very good for both of us.

可以的，最棒的是我所擅长的领域与布鲁诺的大不相同，所以我们能做到互补，双赢的状态。

Journalist: Summer

记者：萨默

Since you have been in Shenzhen, China for a few days, how do you see the whole blockchain anti-counterfeit business in China, as well as, comparing to worldwide. 

您已经在中国深圳呆了一阵子，那么您怎么看待中国和整个区块链防伪事业的发展，与世界其他国家相比如何？

Guest: Bruno Moraes

嘉宾：布鲁诺•莫赖斯

We see an amazing technology that DITO is bringing to this space, which is probably going to be one of the leaders in this space. So we are very happy to be here and visit DITO, and be able to collaborate with them and helping DITO to bring their product to the European market and also giving our own input to their solution. We are very happy with what we have seen here.

我们认为DITO在这个领域所推出的产品与技术，将引领整个行业。我们很高兴有机会访问DITO，并有机会与他们合作，且帮助DITO一同将他们的产品方案推广到欧洲市场，和参与到这件事情里面来。这儿的一切都让人无比兴奋。

Journalist: Summer

记者：萨默

And from your perspective as a European or as a Brazilian, how do you see that blockchain technology is entering the anti-counterfeit business. How do you see it going? Do you think that this is good technology to introduce? Is that something you are interested in?

您作为一名欧洲人，或者巴西人，您是如何看待区块链技术与防伪业务的结合。现在市场形势如何？你认为这是一项值得推荐的先进技术吗？这些是否是你们所感兴趣的领域？

Guest: Attul Sehgal

嘉宾：阿图尔•塞加尔

What I have seen over the years in innovation is that we trying to prove that technology can fix problems. So if you take it from that perspective and see the problems that blockchain can help address it is things about security, identity, and removing bureaucracy. If you are thinking about the counterfeiting market, it is a place where a brand’s trusted identity is being challenged. This is the business problem. Having a secure platform solution where information is stored and can never be erased leads us to think that there is a need for a blockchain-type solution. But I think on the other hand the blockchain solution is just a technology, it has to work with RFID or/and IOT devices to make a proposition to address the original business problem, which is a journey that we both face in our time. 

结合以往多年的经验来看，创新技术是能够（真正做到）解决问题的。如果你从这个角度来看这个问题，那么区块链能够帮助解决的问题会涉及安全、身份认证、和去官僚化。如果你以假货市场（为例），那么这是一个品牌诚信形象备受挑衅的地方。这是一个商业（行业）问题。因而，在一个安全且信息无法更改删除的平台进行信息存储，则是我们都需要的区块链相关方案的（重要原因之一）。另一方面来看，区块链解决方案则是一项技术，它必须要和RFID和/或物联网技术设备搭配使用来一起解决长久以来（企业面临的）商业问题; 正如我们目前经历的进程。

Guest: Bruno Moraes

嘉宾：布鲁诺•莫赖斯

Just back to your question, I think one of the challenges not only to blockchain but to all technology is to ultimately build a product that is simple and attractive for the end user to interact with, to create and make it user friendly and simple. We can see like probably one of the greatest example is the mobile phones that have existed for a number of years and suddenly it became easy to use and a right interface just flexible that transform the way we interact. For all technology, this is probably the most important component to get the adoptions and by being simple and almost transparent to the fact.

回到您的问题，我认为不管是区块链技术，还是其他（未提及）技术，这些技术面临的问题是如果以简单且有吸引力的方式来与用户产生互动，更用户友好和简单。我们看到最好的例子就是手机，这项发明已经面世多年，但是突然之间，它变得非常容易上手，拥有非常灵活的界面，改变了大家互动的方式。对于任何技术而言，最重要的要素无非是不停地改变，变得更加简洁、清楚，以满足客户需求。

Guest: Attul Sehgal

嘉宾：阿图尔•塞加尔

Like a case example, in my early days, I was very much surprised about the billions we spent on 3G spectrum, but its only until somebody from the outside came along and looked at the whole mobile internet experience and developed a unique proposition that made the internet and smartphones really took off; so I think that is a very good case example on how we can make blockchain successful.

拿一个案例来说明，早些年，我对我们花费数十亿元研发3G网络感到非常震惊，直到其他领域的人也参与其中，纵览整个历程，并加以研发，推动了互联网和智能手机产业；所以我认为区块链技术也是可以参考这个案例，并变的十分成功（和普及）。

Journalist: Summer

记者：萨默

So, is there anything else you want to say to people doing business in blockchain, or doing business in China or in the UK, in Brazil and anything you would like to add as an advice.

所以，您还有其他经验想和区块链事业的同行分享的吗？或者说给中国、英国或者巴西的企业提出些建议吗？

Guest: Bruno Moraes

嘉宾：布鲁诺•莫赖斯

I think that for anyone that wants to play in this space, especially the blockchain space is that they have to come to china, they have to see what’s happening here on the ground, they cannot ignore the amazing development that is happening in this place, that would be my main advice. 

我认为，对于任何想要涉足该领域（尤其是区块链领域）的人来说，他们必须要来到中国，见证在这块土地上发生的一切，他们无法忽视这些令人惊叹的发展，这就是我最重要的建议。

Guest: Attul Sehgal

嘉宾：阿图尔•塞加尔

I think for me is the perception from the west especially maybe the suspicion regarding what’s happening in China. I have found a lot of positive experience heres; the communities are very friendly. I can speak a few words like Ni Hao you suddenly open many doors and I think for any executive coming here, the experience of the country is of great value, very refreshing.

以我而言，从西方的角度来看中国的发展总是带着怀疑的眼光。我在这里见到了与众不同的景象；这里的行业同仁非常友好。现在我可以说一些简答的中文，如“你好”。对于任何高层管理人员来说，突然之间，他们眼前会豁然开朗，这个国家所经历的一切都是非常有价值的，是令人振奋的。

Journalist: Summer

记者：萨默

Thank you very much for this interview.

非常感谢你们接受这次访问。